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[220.235.14.97]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id mt2sm17866893pjb.7.2020.11.15.23.15.32 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 15 Nov 2020 23:15:33 -0800 (PST) References: <2020-11-13T18-23-43@devnull.Karl-Voit.at> <874klqew77.fsf@web.de> <20201115122154.50ad1503@linux-h0yu.fritz.box> <87tutq67ka.fsf@gmail.com> <87tutpvppm.fsf@kyleam.com> <877dqlby74.fsf@gmail.com> User-agent: mu4e 1.5.7; emacs 27.1.50 From: Tim Cross To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Changed list indentation behavior: how to revert? In-reply-to: <877dqlby74.fsf@gmail.com> Message-ID: <871rgtbwml.fsf@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2020 18:15:30 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::42b; envelope-from=theophilusx@gmail.com; helo=mail-pf1-x42b.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Scanner: ns3122888.ip-94-23-21.eu Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=SZs96SGV; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Spam-Score: -0.71 X-TUID: dmWSWbUrOC79 Tim Cross writes: > Kyle Meyer writes: > >> K=C3=A9vin Le Gouguec writes: >> >>> Detlef Steuer writes: >>> Note that indenting section bodies by default predates Org 9.4: in Org >>> 9.3, hitting TAB on the first line of text after a heading indents it to >>> column LEVEL+1. >> >> Yes, org-adapt-indentation has been around (with a default of t) since >> 4be4c5623 (version 4.12a, 2008-01-31). >> >>> IMHO, the default value of org-adapt-indentation might be the issue here >>> (made more visible by the change in 9.4): I agree that hard-indenting >>> prose should not be the default behaviour. FWIW the .dir-locals.el file >>> at the root of Org's own repository sets this variable to nil; maybe >>> that suggests that it would be a better default? >> >> Perhaps. I certainly prefer org-adapt-indentation at nil and would vote >> for that if we were introducing the option today, but this would be >> changing a longstanding default. >> >> So, it seems that changing Org to honor electric-indent-mode is now >> making some users aware of org-adapt-indentation and that its default >> value is not what they want. > > Thanks for clarifying this Kyle. > > So essentially, this change has been made to make org-mode consistent > with the rest of emacs which enabled electric-indent by default in Emacs > 24. this is a good thing. Org should be consistent with other modes. Any > differences are likely to be the source of confusion and bug reports. > > I am a little confused about the purpose of org-adapt-indentation > though. According to the org news file, to get back the old behaviour, > it says to explicity disable electric-indent mode using org-mode-hook. > There is no mention of org-adapt-indentation. > > Is this just an artefact from before and in effect, we have two methods > to disable the indentation behaviour? Is there anything functionally > different between disabling electric-indent by calling > electric-indent-local-mode -1 or setting org-adapt-indent to nil or is > the result functionally equivalent? > Following up to my own question. The two are NOT functionally equivalent in that org-adapt-indentation supports other values than t or nil. You can use this variable to tweak how the adaptive indentation works. While setting it to nil may be equivalent to turning of electric-indent mode, it can be used to adjust how adaptive indentation works as well. Tim -- Tim Cross