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From: "Kévin Le Gouguec" <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com>
To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Changed list indentation behavior: how to revert?
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 2020 13:44:02 +0100
Message-ID: <871rgu7pt9.fsf@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <X7Arl0hn16QLyJag@protected.rcdrun.com>

Jean Louis <bugs@gnu.support> writes:

> Indentation in fundamental mode:
>
> ** HereRET
> I come here.
> But only if I start indenting
>    Like hereRET
>    Then I continue here

Hi Jean,

My understanding of electric-indent-mode is that it tries to make "RET"
equivalent to "insert newline; indent according to major mode rules".
E.g. in c-mode, when point is after the brace:

if (condition) {

RET will move point to column 2, while C-j will just insert a newline
and stay at column 0.

Likewise in python-mode, when point is after the colon:

def foobar():

RET will insert a newline and move point to column 4; C-j will stay at
column 0.

Your counter-example in fundamental-mode only shows that there are no
"smart indentation" rules in this mode; hitting TAB more than once keeps
on inserting horizontal space unconditionally instead of snapping to the
"correct" indentation level.


I've used Emacs's programming language modes for years before finally
trying out Org, where I noticed that the keys were swapped: RET was the
"plain dumb newline" key, and C-j was the "smart newline-then-indent"
key.  IIUC this was how the rest of Emacs behaved before
electric-indent-mode became enabled by default.

I personally found the difference infuriating.  Everywhere else in
Emacs,
- C-m and <Return> do smart indentation,
- C-j ≡ ^J ≡ (insert "\N{LINE FEED (LF)}")

The changes in Org 9.4 aimed to make Org consistent with this "new"
convention, so that hitting RET immediately indents paragraphs below a
heading (as if the user hit TAB right after inserting a newline), and a
user wishing to "just insert some vertical space" can just whale on C-j.


FWIW, what I wonder about is /why/ Org hard-indents section bodies by
default (org-indent-mode, which I use, soft-indents instead using
overlays).

IIUC this can be toggled off by setting org-adapt-indentation to nil;
FWIW this is what the .dir-locals.el file at the root of Org's
repository does…


I haven't read this whole thread thoroughly; I've had trouble staying on
top of Emacs's mailing lists this week.

Apologies if I've missed something, and thanks for your patience.



  reply	other threads:[~2020-11-15 12:45 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 76+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-11-13 17:30 Karl Voit
2020-11-13 21:10 ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-13 21:38   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14  3:02     ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-13 21:47   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-13 22:13     ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-13 22:21       ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14 17:28         ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-14 19:10           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 12:44             ` Kévin Le Gouguec [this message]
2020-11-15 13:26               ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 21:59                 ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-15 22:15                   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-16  7:15                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16  6:26               ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-14 10:45   ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-13 21:31 ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14 22:43 ` David Rogers
2020-11-15  5:38   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15  7:47     ` David Rogers
2020-11-15  8:54       ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 10:37       ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-15 11:42         ` Tim Cross
2020-11-15 11:48         ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-15 11:58           ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-15 12:09           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 14:50             ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-15 15:11               ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 10:44       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-15 11:22         ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-15 14:03           ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-16  5:24             ` Kyle Meyer
2020-11-16  6:41               ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16  7:15                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 11:21                   ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-16 23:24                     ` T.F. Torrey
2020-11-17  1:21                       ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-17  7:01                         ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  7:48                       ` Michal Politowski
2020-11-19  4:17                     ` Marcel Ventosa
2020-11-16  8:06                 ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-16 12:10                 ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16  6:54               ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-16  7:12                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17  4:03                   ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-17  5:25                     ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17 13:15                       ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-16  7:01               ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16  7:22                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 16:04                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16 16:26                     ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 18:12                       ` gyro funch
2020-11-16 18:48                         ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 19:41                           ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16 19:56                             ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 21:50                             ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 23:01                               ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 21:44                           ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 18:20                       ` gyro funch
2020-11-16 20:56                       ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 21:35                         ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16 22:44                         ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 23:55                         ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  9:05                           ` Stefan Nobis
2020-11-17  9:15                             ` Loris Bennett
2020-11-17  9:32                             ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-17 14:29                             ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17 16:25                               ` Robert Pluim
2020-11-16 23:39                       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16 21:35                     ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17  0:11                       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  8:45                         ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-17  9:41                           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-17 15:33                     ` Maxim Nikulin
2020-11-16 13:00                 ` Uwe Brauer
2020-11-16 16:10                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide

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