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[220.235.7.211]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c5sm9650965pfn.144.2021.06.13.00.47.52 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 13 Jun 2021 00:47:53 -0700 (PDT) References: <87r1h6fv72.fsf@gmail.com> <1122819.1623558460@apollo2.minshall.org> User-agent: mu4e 1.5.13; emacs 27.2.50 From: Tim Cross To: Greg Minshall Subject: Re: literate programming, development log -- ideas? 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1623570505; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=2K+b1lLTAcsDybtTP7UYzmhSMUwA+A2CZdA+hpaQJXk=; b=sjGBRkbKxPw83rg+5/q4alLAMHIuN+3PgQG9NhwDmxlHFCpJY39nykVs7EMnwysLNfxssG pBMQQ+TC7kfPdQLZ2uzGp173tg4BStnOl/Rl8jXsmMZayAar23CYkiliK+6KyevVJUCFfs f3CqTLr64X+jkF32OIeXJo4erBCLdXJq1T7+mpbp6iiriH5fmjbbe9uNBP+RYKkU/jNc32 qfC4+PAhxAO0mka8xisYpf3zAviRW9ROEzXS0YcRPGUi+JXVEIVB2W9t9XtXlhtUvCJ1MN 7o8B6Z8UzG921B8iEaHWI51I4iWrOlYoyf7jqgNsYwb+Q6nFJic26ZaSC5Z+hQ== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1623570505; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=GSyVuPtRbEVGTcPlMSaCVKJEgszh8eyKHxWn8U98MVhUbYIoaLEkx6oP2jCshsS/Jma9V+ Up70e12dnDCtgoVlugSYjdmop+QOPz7isKqhiUSE55zobdA+0NiwiS7GEq+w7cIVDtZpcy ZPdoH+ig+AUhZEPHvTh9ArGSgdLp2U6kaeeiSN+UoEwhNBDSmnonCV1MK9H549AW5SQXmx c3xtaIKAuUNm5uuUWDinA70DqSnib9qDxEkTSeYccQDwLjc2I9QL1kTCHunN6fvzUfGTUw Lh0k5k2D+zmDJM6r8MZy2idHSiix8QOx2Yes0Rgs31lmPo7PjAz8vI8OA1EuTw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=bdWijKFU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -1.62 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=bdWijKFU; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 14F7625DF4 X-Spam-Score: -1.62 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-TUID: D12YlQM0rinX Greg Minshall writes: > Tim, > > thanks for your comments. > >> A lot depends on whether what you want is an org file which documents >> the current state of play or one which is more similar to a lab book >> which contains a more chronological type evolution of ideas and >> experiments. I often setup completely separate org 'projects' which will >> consist of multiple org files and will move things between different >> files as the project evolves. In some extreme cases, I may even have >> multiple git branches and will often use git tags to mark specific >> 'milestones'. >> >> How I decide whether to use a date tree with notes, branches, tags, >> archive sections/files, separate org files etc is typically determined >> by how likely I might be to want to review or go back through previous >> work/experiments/decisions. Working this out can take a bit of time and >> experimentation, but in general, I rarely need to checkout old versions >> or even open archive trees/files. I do have a journal file for each >> major project which has lots of ideas, random thoughts and even small >> experiments (with source blokcs) and I tend ot have a large 'reference' >> file which contains notes and links to external references and then a >> 'main' org file, which reflects the current state. > > my current curiosity is in how to integrate lab book, brain storming, > functionality into my projects. it seems as if, in an extreme case, you > might possibly have > - a lab book sort of file (i.e., date order, minimal "going back and > correcting entries") > - a journal file, unstructured, not-infrequently updated, notes, URLs, > etc. > - the "main" org file -- that which "ships". > - an archive file (one per each of the other?) > > for any given project, is the evolution from =foo.org= to this larger > number sort of organic, in the sense that you start with one file, then, > at some point, say, "okay, i need to put these bits in a new journal > file"? > > and, trying to leverage the brain cells of others, have you tended to > settle on any sort of consistent naming scheme for the different files? > =-log=, =-notes=, etc.? > > i suspect that if my brain were more git-shaped, i'd find the idea of > separate files easier. i.e., my instinct is to think of each of these > files as having a version-path independent of the others. rather than > the git-view, which is that the version-path is the commit-path, and > each commit includes the (mostly-temporally) related versions of each of > again, thanks! Greg For me, the growth was quite organic. I still have quite a few single file 'projects' where everything is in one file (with top level headings for the different 'bits'). In fact, nearly all my org usage has followed an organic approach. When I first started with org, I made the common mistake of getting in and defining lots of todo states, tags, templates for different structures, lots of capture templates etc etc. I later realised this was a big mistake and ended up being a fine example of over engineering. I ended up going back to a stock standard org setup with next to no configuration. I then used this 'out of the box' setup for a while and worked out how to do what I wanted using what org already had. I avoided installing any additional org related packages. Once I was familiar with what org has and how to use it, I then began to refine my workflow bit by bit. I slowly started tweaking my configuration and added some simple elisp functions to make my life easier. I then systematically looked at various org packages I had heard about and installed a couple which I found useful. I now have a very workable and nice workflow where org is integrated into most of what I do. There is a bit in my config, but most of it is just setting various org variables, a few capture templates, a custom agenda view and some tweaking to some of the export stuff. While I use org pretty much daily, there is a lot of org I just don't use. For example, I only use tags very sparingly. I use babel to generate my init.el, numerous config files (my zsh shell setup, my mbsync and lots of other config files) and I have some language 'logbook' projects where I experiment and learn different languages, frameworks etc. I tend not to use babel/literate programming with full on coding projects. I will use org for documentation, issue tracking, notes etc. However, for 'real' code projects, I tend to keep the code in 'normal' language dependent files rather than adopt a full literate/noweb style of development. I do often use org to document and manage deployment scripts and some 'devops' type stuff though. -- Tim Cross