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From: "Kévin Le Gouguec" <kevin.legouguec@gmail.com>
To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Changed list indentation behavior: how to revert?
Date: Sun, 15 Nov 2020 15:03:33 +0100
Message-ID: <87tutq67ka.fsf@gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20201115122154.50ad1503@linux-h0yu.fritz.box>

Detlef Steuer <steuer@hsu-hh.de> writes:

> I'm constantly bitten by that change, but was too lazy to dig for the
> cause. But now that I know, I want to add 2c.
>
> If one writes prose it looks much more natural to have
>
> * Healine<Ret>
>
> start editing in column 1 of next row.
> (Personally I would prefer to start at row 3, but independent
>  of the depth of the heading. Probably there is a setting already?)
>
> C-j is fine and nice, but I *feel* the default should be the other
> way round.
>
> I'm in no way emotional about these changes, but as Arne demonstrates
> in his example text, org files become less readable when using the new
> default. Heavy indenting is not what we are used to see if we have
> subheadings in prose. Readability of org on the screen should be very high
> in list of usability target. (Most probably it indeed is for the developers!
> I'm not assuming you would neglect it!)
> Maybe all boils down to a matter of taste, but at least imho Arne's
> example shows the problem quite clearly.
>
> For lists or sequences of mostly empty headings this does not matter
> as much.
>
> Furthermore: If I understand correctly electric-ident mode is thought to
> be a helper for programming major modes. In my opinion org is no (not
> only, much more than a) programming mode, so maybe electric ident is not
> the optimal default. 

Note that indenting section bodies by default predates Org 9.4: in Org
9.3, hitting TAB on the first line of text after a heading indents it to
column LEVEL+1.

IMHO, the default value of org-adapt-indentation might be the issue here
(made more visible by the change in 9.4): I agree that hard-indenting
prose should not be the default behaviour.  FWIW the .dir-locals.el file
at the root of Org's own repository sets this variable to nil; maybe
that suggests that it would be a better default?

(As I said in my reply to Jean Louis: I've only skimmed over this
thread; apologies if I've missed anything.)



  reply	other threads:[~2020-11-15 14:04 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 76+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2020-11-13 17:30 Karl Voit
2020-11-13 21:10 ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-13 21:38   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14  3:02     ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-13 21:47   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-13 22:13     ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-13 22:21       ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14 17:28         ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-14 19:10           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 12:44             ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-15 13:26               ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 21:59                 ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-15 22:15                   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-16  7:15                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16  6:26               ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-14 10:45   ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-13 21:31 ` Jean Louis
2020-11-14 22:43 ` David Rogers
2020-11-15  5:38   ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15  7:47     ` David Rogers
2020-11-15  8:54       ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 10:37       ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-15 11:42         ` Tim Cross
2020-11-15 11:48         ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-15 11:58           ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-15 12:09           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 14:50             ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-15 15:11               ` Jean Louis
2020-11-15 10:44       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-15 11:22         ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-15 14:03           ` Kévin Le Gouguec [this message]
2020-11-16  5:24             ` Kyle Meyer
2020-11-16  6:41               ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16  7:15                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 11:21                   ` Gustavo Barros
2020-11-16 23:24                     ` T.F. Torrey
2020-11-17  1:21                       ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-17  7:01                         ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  7:48                       ` Michal Politowski
2020-11-19  4:17                     ` Marcel Ventosa
2020-11-16  8:06                 ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-11-16 12:10                 ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16  6:54               ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-16  7:12                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17  4:03                   ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-17  5:25                     ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17 13:15                       ` Greg Minshall
2020-11-16  7:01               ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16  7:22                 ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 16:04                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16 16:26                     ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 18:12                       ` gyro funch
2020-11-16 18:48                         ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 19:41                           ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16 19:56                             ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 21:50                             ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 23:01                               ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 21:44                           ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 18:20                       ` gyro funch
2020-11-16 20:56                       ` Tim Cross
2020-11-16 21:35                         ` Bill Burdick
2020-11-16 22:44                         ` Tom Gillespie
2020-11-16 23:55                         ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  9:05                           ` Stefan Nobis
2020-11-17  9:15                             ` Loris Bennett
2020-11-17  9:32                             ` Diego Zamboni
2020-11-17 14:29                             ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17 16:25                               ` Robert Pluim
2020-11-16 23:39                       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-16 21:35                     ` Tim Cross
2020-11-17  0:11                       ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
2020-11-17  8:45                         ` Detlef Steuer
2020-11-17  9:41                           ` Jean Louis
2020-11-17 15:33                     ` Maxim Nikulin
2020-11-16 13:00                 ` Uwe Brauer
2020-11-16 16:10                   ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide

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