From: Jean Louis <firstname.lastname@example.org> To: Detlef Steuer <email@example.com> Cc: "Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide" <firstname.lastname@example.org>, Tim Cross <email@example.com>, firstname.lastname@example.org Subject: Re: Changed list indentation behavior: how to revert? Date: Tue, 17 Nov 2020 12:41:41 +0300 Message-ID: <X7Oa1b3zb55jzFmM@protected.rcdrun.com> (raw) In-Reply-To: <email@example.com> * Detlef Steuer <firstname.lastname@example.org> [2020-11-17 11:47]: :PROPERTIES: :CREATED: [2020-11-17 Tue 12:41] :ID: 2bc18302-d009-4751-b062-b3cf2aa44d18 :END: > It is *impossible* to force users to be informed. Think about us: We > all hang around on this list and missed the information. What would > reasonably be expected from a casual user? Often it is not even clear > what the consequences are, even if you read the NEWS. "Org now uses > electric-indent" only is meaningful to very few people who can guess > what that will mean for their workflow. News in Org mode is already very prominent, but I never read it. It is in the Org Menu documentation sub menu that leads to the website. But I would say it is much better having NEWS locally as not everybody has Internet with Org mode. News for specific user should refer to changes from previous version of that user. Not every user will have same Org version. They will not understand news if it refers to higher version which they may not have. Org is distributed over many communication channels together with Emacs. Users of many GNU/Linux distributions and FreeBSD and other BSD derivatives are getting it packaged, there are many different versions. NEWS could be made more prominent by adding NEWS links to Org Info file. I could not find any. So it is not hyperlinks. Logically the Org documentation should link to Org news and hereby I do not mean to link to the website but to link to the relevant news pertaining to specific version of Org, and such file should be together with the Org distribution. It is on my side in: /package/text/emacs-2020-11-14/share/emacs/28.0.50/etc/ORG-NEWS But does ANYTHING within Org mode points there to that file? I do not think user will find the relevant news. How is user to find the reference if reference is not given? I am using Emacs development version from 2020-11-14, 3 days ago. The ORG-NEWS is explaining about Org version 9.3 as that is what I wish to read as I am on that version (probably). Org menu, submenu Documentation is pointing to Browse News that is showing me Org news for version 9.4. That is not consistent as version 9.3 should not show me news for version 9.4. But then if I look into newer Org package installed I can even see news for version 9.5 and it says there "not yet released". From my personal view point this is all fine. I am speaking from interface design and consistency. The link from Org menu could maybe point to the specific local file ORG-NEWS for the specific version installed. That way users on version 9.2 would see news for version 9.2. Those for version 9.3 see for 9.3 and so on. It makes things consistent. Users on this mailing list are power users. There are thousands of users who may not have neither power nor Internet to install new packages or update packages. They get it delivered through Emacs and use Emacs on the multi user system. Emacs is part of GNU system. That means somebody as administrator installs the OS and OS is used for example in multi user environment. Such environment need not have Internet access neither would install new versions of Org as the version of Emacs from GNU Linux distribution "just works". We have to think of all those users and design should drive itself for developers or power users only. Emacs version on GNU Hyperbola/Linux-libre is 25.3-3.hyperbola2 and I do not know which Org version is inside. This version I have installed in multi user environment. Why should a staff member using that version, which is functional, be looking into news pertaining to version 9.4 on the website which does not relate to version on the system? It is not consistent. And such member would not be even able to see the news on the website because computer is not connected to Internet. NEWS could be made more prominent to system administrators who install the package by placing some notices in commentary of the package, or where exactly? When I install the package or in package description there could be link to the news or notice that NEWS shall be read.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2020-11-17 9:48 UTC|newest] Thread overview: 76+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top 2020-11-13 17:30 Karl Voit 2020-11-13 21:10 ` Gustavo Barros 2020-11-13 21:38 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-14 3:02 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-13 21:47 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-13 22:13 ` Gustavo Barros 2020-11-13 22:21 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-14 17:28 ` Diego Zamboni 2020-11-14 19:10 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 12:44 ` Kévin Le Gouguec 2020-11-15 13:26 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 21:59 ` Kévin Le Gouguec 2020-11-15 22:15 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-16 7:15 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-16 6:26 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-14 10:45 ` Diego Zamboni 2020-11-13 21:31 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-14 22:43 ` David Rogers 2020-11-15 5:38 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 7:47 ` David Rogers 2020-11-15 8:54 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 10:37 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-15 11:42 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-15 11:48 ` Gustavo Barros 2020-11-15 11:58 ` Detlef Steuer 2020-11-15 12:09 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 14:50 ` Gustavo Barros 2020-11-15 15:11 ` Jean Louis 2020-11-15 10:44 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-15 11:22 ` Detlef Steuer 2020-11-15 14:03 ` Kévin Le Gouguec 2020-11-16 5:24 ` Kyle Meyer 2020-11-16 6:41 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 7:15 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 11:21 ` Gustavo Barros 2020-11-16 23:24 ` T.F. Torrey 2020-11-17 1:21 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-17 7:01 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-17 7:48 ` Michal Politowski 2020-11-19 4:17 ` Marcel Ventosa 2020-11-16 8:06 ` Kévin Le Gouguec 2020-11-16 12:10 ` Bill Burdick 2020-11-16 6:54 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-16 7:12 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-17 4:03 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-17 5:25 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-17 13:15 ` Greg Minshall 2020-11-16 7:01 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-16 7:22 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 16:04 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-16 16:26 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-16 18:12 ` gyro funch 2020-11-16 18:48 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-16 19:41 ` Bill Burdick 2020-11-16 19:56 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-16 21:50 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 23:01 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-16 21:44 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 18:20 ` gyro funch 2020-11-16 20:56 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-16 21:35 ` Bill Burdick 2020-11-16 22:44 ` Tom Gillespie 2020-11-16 23:55 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-17 9:05 ` Stefan Nobis 2020-11-17 9:15 ` Loris Bennett 2020-11-17 9:32 ` Diego Zamboni 2020-11-17 14:29 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-17 16:25 ` Robert Pluim 2020-11-16 23:39 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-16 21:35 ` Tim Cross 2020-11-17 0:11 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide 2020-11-17 8:45 ` Detlef Steuer 2020-11-17 9:41 ` Jean Louis [this message] 2020-11-17 15:33 ` Maxim Nikulin 2020-11-16 13:00 ` Uwe Brauer 2020-11-16 16:10 ` Dr. Arne Babenhauserheide
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